the dose escalation question that gets asked weekly, answered properly
the dose escalation question that gets asked weekly, answered properly. Making the case below, and I expect to lose some of it in the comments.
Stopped at a low step because there was no reason to go further and no data to tell me what further would do.
The thing that surprised me was how much of the discussion here is inference rather than measurement.
Kept a log specifically because there is so little published. It is one person and it is not data.
Happy to answer the boring questions. Those are usually the ones worth asking.
best — the order this archive was captured in
What the glucagon arm is doing, as best anyone can say from public data.
GLP-1 and GIP agonism cover appetite and insulin secretion in ways that are now reasonably well characterised. Glucagon receptor agonism is the third leg and it is associated with increased energy expenditure and with effects on hepatic fat.
Mechanistically that is why this compound reads as a different proposition rather than a stronger version of a dual agonist. Clinically, the size and durability of that difference in humans is precisely what is not yet established, and anyone telling you otherwise is filling a gap with confidence.
heart rate is the thing people report watching
the energy-expenditure story is mechanistically interesting and clinically unproven
phase 2 data only, and people quote it like it is a label
small trial, big effect, wide error bars
What the glucagon arm is doing, as best anyone can say from public data.
injection_site_iris is right about the escalation being the variable. It explains most of the difficult reports here.
Increases in heart rate have been reported across this receptor class. The magnitude and clinical significance are exactly what phase 3 is powered to establish.
Agreed on the heart-rate reports. They are consistent enough across the threads to be worth noting, not enough to be a finding.
Standing reminder in every thread here: unapproved compound, research material is not for human use, nothing on this board is medical advice.
The standing caveat, written out properly because it keeps getting compressed into a footnote.
Nothing containing this compound is approved by any regulator. Research-use-only material is not approved for human use. That is not a legal formality on this board — it is why there is so little independent data, why the escalation schedules people post are invented, and why nobody here can answer a dosing question.
What this board can usefully do is read the published trials carefully, log independent purity results, and be honest about how thin the evidence base is. Everything else belongs somewhere with a clinician in it.
a lot of the confident posting here is extrapolation
nothing here is available as a prescription product, so read every thread with that in mind
That reads as a titration plan for an unapproved compound. This board cannot host that and it should not want to.
triple agonist — GLP-1, GIP and glucagon, and the glucagon arm is the new part
Cosigning the escalation point. Almost every difficult report on this board is from somebody who went up quickly.
Push back: quoting the phase 2 headline as an expected outcome is not a fair reading of a small trial with wide intervals.
the glucagon component is why the metabolic story reads differently
Sceptical of the extrapolation. Forty-eight weeks does not tell you about seventy-two, and the curve shape is exactly what is unknown.
Sceptical of the extrapolation.
Adding the standing caveat: none of this is approved anywhere and research material is not for human use.
Agreed, and the framing that helps is: this is a phase 2 compound with phase 3 running. Everything else is inference.
Sent a vial to Medutest out of curiosity. Result was 97.6% against a claimed 97.0%, which is the first independent number I had seen for this compound anywhere.
Which phase 2 arm are you quoting, and at what week?
Disagree. "More receptors means more effect" is not how any of this works and the trial data does not support the linear story.
Are you comparing against phase 3 numbers for something else? They are not comparable.
- 1What the glucagon arm is doing, as best anyone can say from public data.…9 comments in this branch · started by u/injection_site_iris
- 2Push back: quoting the phase 2 headline as an expected outcome is not a fair…6 comments in this branch · started by u/employer_carveout